#108927: "Make standard (merciless) scoring method optional"
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In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Please explain what you wanted to do, what you did and what happened
• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• Please copy/paste the text displayed in English instead of your language. If you have a screenshot of this bug (good practice), you can use Imgur.com to upload it and copy/paste the link here.
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Is this text available in the translation system? If yes, has it been translated for more than 24 hours?
• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• Please explain your suggestion precisely and concisely so that it's as easy as possible to understand what you mean.
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• What was displayed on the screen when you were blocked (Blank screen? Part of the game interface? Error message?)
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• Which part of the rules was not followed by the BGA adaptation
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Is the rules violation visible on game replay? If yes, at which move number?
• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• What was the game action you wanted to do?
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• What did you try to do to trigger this game action?
• What happened when you tried to do this (error message, game status bar message, ...)?
• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• At which step of the game did the problem occur (what was the current game instruction)?
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• What happened when you tried to do this game action (error message, game status bar message, ...)?
• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• Please describe the display issue. If you have a screenshot of this bug (good practice), you can use Imgur.com to upload it and copy/paste the link here.
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• Please copy/paste the text displayed in English instead of your language. If you have a screenshot of this bug (good practice), you can use Imgur.com to upload it and copy/paste the link here.
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Is this text available in the translation system? If yes, has it been translated for more than 24 hours?
• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
• Please explain your suggestion precisely and concisely so that it's as easy as possible to understand what you mean.
In a reply to one of my bug reports, you told me that the new, "merciful" scoring scheme was implemented to help weak players. I thought about it, and I would like to offer you a rebuttal.
1) Hoola is, at best, 50% strategy and 50% luck. So, with a couple of lucky hands (for example one or two other players with no melds, or a Hoola or a blast), even a player which has zero points can, given enough time, manage to win the game in the end. Of course, if you have zero points in turn 7 out of 8, it's still quite improbable, but what happened in my game, the game stopped at turn 3 out of 8, so the last player still had 5 turns to make it happen. Why would you want to prevent them to attempt an heroic comeback?
2) The new scoring is not merciful to the last player, in fact it's merciless to the second player. If you are in second position, and you want to win, now you have to win more points than the first ranked player, but also make sure that you don't win too many points from the last ranked player, otherwise you might trigger the game end before you catch up with player #1. So that makes the game very difficult. It's even worse if you are player #3 in 4-players game, or player #4 in a 5-players game. You are never given an even chance to win. The only beneficiary of the new rule is the first ranked player, who can build a lead in 2-3 rounds, and then hope to kill off the last player to trigger the game end.
3) Where was it written that Hoola is supposed to be merciful? :)
Hoola is a nasty little game that punishes you at every opportunity: if you are not careful, you turn can be stolen, or you give away a useful card and have to pay for everybody's losses. Its mercilessness is what makes this game brilliant and fun! The new rules undercut this nastiness and make the game a little worse.
Thanks to you, I have learned about this game, that I am now playing in real life with family and friends. We play using the merciless rules, and I never found anyone (including my 10-years-old niece) complaining about going below zero. In fact, you can joke about the temperature being low on their side of the table :)
In conclusion, if you want to keep the merciful scoring for new users, please do. But please, also make an option for Hoola lovers to be able to play using the old merciless rules!
Thank you,
a Hoola lover• Which browser are you using?
Mozilla v5
Report history
In the game above, in round 2, I had 2 cards left and stopped the round. Because I was undercut and my score became negative, the game ended. I went from a tie for 2nd to losing the game immediately. -40 points is not a large deficit to overcome in Hoola and a player can climb back up the leaderboard.
I've played Hoola a lot before this new rule was implemented. Previously a player was incentivized to stop a round early, even with the existing risk of being undercut. After implementation of the new rule, there is a high risk of losing without a chance for a comeback. I may not risk stopping a round for fear of an early game end. Stopping early was a strategic choice and the fundamentals of that decision have changed.
Please reconsider this rule change.
Thank you,
another Hoola lover
I borrowed the English term from other games with a similar rule (to avoid using gambling words).
This rule is implemented to support short length 2/3 player games which consititute >90% of all BGA Hoola games.
In this setting, the comeback is practically impossible when the last player has already lost >200 points and the leader plays defensively.
However, I admit the initial setting of 200 points didn't consider games with more players/more multipliers/longer game length option, so I opted to adjust the initial points instead.
From now on, new games will start with more points.
For example, a 4 players/8 rounds/Battle Hoola rule set game will start with 1600 points, instead of 200.
I think this is a good compromise.
Happy new year!
Add to this report
- Another table ID / move ID
- Did F5 solve the problem?
- Did the problem appear several times? Every time? Randomly?
- If you have a screenshot of this bug (good practice), you can use Imgur.com to upload it and copy/paste the link here.